Comments on: Hello. My Name is Hrafnkell, and I am a Speciesist

By: Hrafnkell Haraldsson

Hrafnkell Haraldsson — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:27:52 +0000

That has always been my point, Siegfried, that there are moderate approaches to any problem that avoid appeal to the extremes. My thinking is encapsulated in my oft-used expression, "I will thank the animal dying for me and I will apologize to the tree for cutting it down, but I will kill the animal and I will cut down the tree."

I wrote another article on moderation in Heathenism (which inspired some truly extremist responses, serving to prove my point). We face many problems as a species and our own Heathen traditions demonstrate the value placed on moderation – intemperate behavior, on the other hand…

The problem as I see it is people come up with ideas or terms like this and then immediately put them to use attacking a position they don't agree with, while ignoring their application across the board (stepping on ants, etc). My point of departure is to say, "Hold on, let's think about what you're saying here…" Which is, as I've said before, the whole point of this blog

By: SiegfriedGoodfellow

SiegfriedGoodfellow — Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:20:32 +0000

Ahimsa exists on a spectrum. There's no need to unnecessarily harm, and different people can take up different stances along that spectrum. I agree that it's technically impossible to live without some harm on this planet, but I suspect that the intent of coining the phrase "speciesism" was to get people to think a little bit differently about their relationship to other species, to encourage a little more ahimsa, and to challenge automatic notions of superiority. Any of us cringe at attempts at homogenous ideological imposition. On the other hand, we can probably all afford, in our own way and from our own liberty, to be a little more thoughtful. After all, all creatures of the Earth are our brethren through Mother Earth. They are therefore deserving of some kind of respect, however we may individually enact that.

By: Hrafnkell Haraldsson

Hrafnkell Haraldsson — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 17:37:39 +0000

Thank you, Jenn. It's awfully hard to tell what's a joke and what isn't. I might laugh and others might wonder what I find so funny. But after seeing this "speciesism" stuff I guess that self-extinction program doesn't sound so crazy.

By: Jenn

Jenn — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 15:41:15 +0000

Thanks for clarifying. I have seen that website before, but I wasn't sure if it was a joke. After reading their commonly asked questions, I get the impression that they are a harmless organization using shock tactics to bring awareness to overpopulation.

I hope I'm not swaying too off topic.
I have read that the population would decrease dramatically if people in general decided to have one or two children as opposed to three or four. We can achieve goals to save the planet by educating our children and changing habits.

Getting back to animals, people are already becoming conscious of the conditions of factory farming, and are buying more organic meat from family farms, buying local veggies, growing our own, and voting with our dollars. This makes a huge impact. Whereas denying one's own humanity where killing something is inevitable does not change minds.

Great post, Hrafnkell.

By: Hrafnkell Haraldsson

Hrafnkell Haraldsson — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 11:31:59 +0000

It's not about not having children, Jenn. I know people who choose not to have children or can't have children.

It's about not having children so that the human race will cease to exist. I finally located the link Ulfrun had sent me: The Voluntary Human Extinction Movement

I love your mom's expression. A very wise woman.

By: Jenn

Jenn — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 03:33:06 +0000

"I know there's a group out there somewhere that swears off reproducing and I consider you people fine candidates for the program."

I'm not sure what you mean by this. I don't see anything wrong with people who choose not to have children (there are quite a few reason's not to for some people.)Some couples are just happier that way, and they tend to get a lot of shit from people. Unless your talking about the type who call people "breeders" and look down on those with families.

That aside, I really like this post. I believe animals deserve a lot of respect. When I see animal cruelty, it cuts deep. However, I also acknowledge the circle of life and death, and as my mom wisely puts it "If there was no death, we'd be up to our assholes in horseflies."

By: Hrafnkell Haraldsson

Hrafnkell Haraldsson — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:21:50 +0000

Killer! Species killer! Yeah, so…are these people anti-grubs in tomato sauces like they sell in some parts of Africa? I mean, grubs have a right to life too, don't they?

I like "shutupism" – beautiful term!

By: Chell

Chell — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:18:25 +0000

Wait! Before the support group meets, I need a quick fix of washing dishes and vacuuming up anything that came in on the firewood. And who knows what'll hit the windshield on the way to the meeting. Speciesism… how 'bout a plateful of shutupism for those who wield this term against others?

By: Hrafnkell Haraldsson

Hrafnkell Haraldsson — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:22:37 +0000

T-shirts sounds great, Cinnabari! Yes, if they were like the Shakers and refuse to breedj (or eat, as the case may be) instead of getting in my business, I'd be happier. My attitude is, don't like it, don't do it, but leave the rest of us the Hel alone.

By: cinnabari

cinnabari — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:38:11 +0000

Heh. I'm reminded of hardcore Jains, who wears the breathing masks and sweep the ground in front of them as they walk to avoid stepping on critters, and who won't eat plants that have to die in order to be consumed (onions, etc). But then, I can kinda respect them, because they're too busy avoiding harm to harass me.

Not so much with the folks who want to shame me into eating their way. Speciesist. Right. Let's make t-shirts.